AMC fees are going up! Many appraisers are swamped with work! You

13 Pages·2012·0.08 MB·English

VOLUME 20 • ISSUE 8 • August 2012
www.appraisaltoday.com
AMC fees are going up! Many appraisers are
swamped with work! You CAN get higher fees!!
By Doug Smith and Ann What about broadcast orders? Sometimes, if it is an assignment or
O'Rourke Don't even look at them. They will client I really want, I will try to com-
be going to the lowest fee appraisers. pete by offering a lower fee.
The number of calls and emails
about appraisal orders from AMCs Or, respond but promise yourself Some prospective clients are fee
that I get are increasing dramatical- you will do whatever it takes to get sensitive, some are not. Why compete
ly. Before a few months ago I very out of the broadcast death spiral to on fee if the client is not fee sensi-
seldom received an order request the lowest fee. tive?
from an AMC. I guess I have been on
What about what otherappraisers What about the appraisers working
the “do not call”AMC list!
are charging? forlow fees?
Commercial appraisals are typical-
Successful businesses keep track of You will be skimming the high fee
ly done on a bid basis. Fees go up
competitor's fees. In the past, with jobs.
and down based on supply and
mortgage brokers and steady Who cares what they do? You are
demand.
appraisal fees, it was easy. Just call going to use this article to weed out
AMC fees also go up and down.
them on the phone posing as a client. those cheapo clients.
Now there is strong demand for
There is a huge range of appraisal Also, you don't know who is ask-
appraisers due to low interest rates
fees now. You may be able to get an ing for, and getting, higher fees.
and the fees AMCs pay are going up.
idea if your AMC clients are raising
Many appraisers are afraid to ask
But, many appraisers are still accept-
fees.
for more money. Let them have the
ing low fees.
Competing only on fees is a death clients who are not on your Approved
AMC fees can vary widely for
race to the bottom. That is how AMC list. Less competition for you.
AMC work for the same property.
AMCs got the upper hand on work.
Residential AMC appraisal fees are
Appraisers had only one way to com- What if you're offended by low fees
based on bids and affected the same
pete, they think. offered by AMCs?
way. Or, at least they offer a fee and
I don't try to compete on fee as you DO NOTEVER get mad at the
you can re-negotiate to a higher fee.
can always find someone cheaper. person on the phone. Why? You will
IFYOU DON'TASK FOR A
be upset and will get stressed, reduc
FEE INCREASE, YOU WON'T
GETONE.
INTHISISSUE
Win-win AMC fee negotiation forappraisers . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Page 3
The Best Web sites and email lists forappraisernetworking, info, and help . . . . . . . . .Page 6
Bad Boys and Bad Girls - including a formerUSPAPinstructorand board member Page 11
August 2012–©Appraisal Today–PAGE 1
ing your appraisal production. Worse, office phone and you are on your cell
don't go home and be stressed with phone. How do you know if AMC fees are
changing?
your family. Work up a script and practice it.
For non-AMC work, it is easy.
They can ask whatever fee they That's the easiest way. Other busi-
Check competitor's web sites.
want. They are flunkies and may, or nesses have been doing this for
Call and ask for a quote, such as on
may not, have no control over the decades.
an estate appraisal of a home.
fees. They do as their boss or compa- Here's an example:
AMC fees are much more difficult.
ny says. AMC order clerk: We have an
Contact other local appraisers and see
appraisal in your area at XXX
Don't EverQuote a fee without address. Our fee is $250. if they are busy with AMC work.
checking out the property first. Many appraisers who had little work
You: Thanks for calling. Let me take
As we all know, appraisals vary in the spring are now swamped.
just a minute to check out the proper-
widely in difficulty and driving time. I have a few local appraisers I
ty online. Ok, I've checked. My fee
If you get orders on your cell check with. Then I know when
for that assignment is $300 - not a
phone, just take a minute to check it demand is going up and fees can be
tract home, too far away, etc.
out on public records in the field. increased. I recently spoke with a
AMC order clerk: Will you take
Don't have a smart phone to do this? local appraiser who had one job in
$275?
Get a smart phone today. If you April (she won't work for low fees).
You: Sorry, I do not accept any fees
phone has slow Internet access, con- Now she is swamped with AMC
under $300. (You really don't want to
sider getting a wifi hotspot for about calls and is getting the same fees, or
do the job.) Or, you can say why, if
$80 or so a month. more, than she got in the pre-AMC
you want to take the time.
In your office, it is easier. Just put days. Often, she doesn't even have to
AMC order clerk: Ok. I will call
the person on hold for a minute to negotiate for higher fees.
someone else. Do you have any rec-
check it out - public records, Zillow, Look at your own business. When
ommendations?
google earth, MLS, or whatever you you ask for fee increases, do they
You: give them the name of your
prefer.. laugh or negotiate?
cheapo competitor who will drive a
80 mile round trip for $200. Keeps
How to ask fora higherfee - it is What about broadcast orders?
them busy while you skim the higher
very easy Don't even bother replying. Work
fee jobs.
Appraisers are in the driver's seat for AMCs that don't broadcast unless
now on fees. In today's very strong you can't find any other work.
AMCs set the "base" fees -
appraisal market, not asking for a Now is the time to look for AMCs
nationally, regionally, orlocally
higher fees is a very bad idea, unless that don't broadcast. Or, try to get on
For many, many years all residen-
you have no work and are desperate the special list where they contact
tial fees were fairly standard in a spe-
for every cheap fee appraisal. But, you directly by email or phone.
cific geographic area, with a narrow
you won't be in that situation very
To negotiate a fee, you need to
range of fees set by local appraisers.
long, hopefully.
communicate with the person who
Fees are still fairly steady for non-
You will have to accept not getting places the order.
AMC work.
every assignment. Some appraisers
Today, some AMCs offer the same
are unable to do this. That's ok. They The First Rule of Pricing
basic fees for every property in every
will just make lots less money. There is always someone with a
state, particularly for URARs. Some
Asking for a higher fee is very, lower price. Don't compete only by
offer different fees, depending on
very easy. Just quote your fee. They price, unless that is your only option.
geographic area. Afew offer different
can say yes or no, or you can negoti- When the market changes, you
fees for complexity of appraisal, but
ate. need to be ready to raise or lower
the clerks sending out the fees don't
Practice doing it with someone else your fees.
know what is hard and what is easier.
- spouse, another appraiser, or almost Pricing is not easy for any busi-
AMCs offer a fee and an appraiser
anyone else. Practice using a tele- ness, including appraisal businesses.
can decline the order or re-negotiate
phone as that is often how you com-
for a higher fee.
municate on fees. If you can't find The Second Rule of Pricing
It is a lot more difficult than for
anyone to practice with, just pick up It's not the fee, it's the hourly rate
non-AMC work, where fees still tend
your phone and try using yourself. that counts. If you take an appraisal
to fall in a narrow range, similar to
For example, your client is on your for $200 and it takes you 4 hours,
the pre-AMC days.
PAGE 2–©Appraisal Today–August 2012
you have billed at $50 per hour. If AMCs. Try them out on 1 or 2 very unlikely that appraisers could
you take 8 hours to complete the appraisals and see how it goes. If you set the prices for all appraisals of a
appraisal, you're billing at $25 per don't like them, drop them. certain type, say URAR lender
hour. How do you make more Get fee information from your appraisals. Firms conspiring on a spe-
money? If your client seems to clients. When you don't get an order, cific bid on a commercial appraisal is
charge the same for every appraisal, call the client and see what fee quote much more likely. Exchange of infor-
only take appraisals close to your got the order. mation is not illegal. Parallel prices
office and that are not complicated. If you're working for an AMC, ask are not illegal. Exchanging informa-
Use time saving techniques to cut them what fee is needed to get tion to set parallel prices is illegal. If
down on your time. Afew ideas are: orders. you're really worried, anonymously
- Take all the possible comps and call other offices for fee quotes. I'm
listings with you in the field. Asec- How to increase income, without sure some of the fee quote calls you
ond trip is money lost. increasing "prices" receive are from other appraisal
- Learn to handle your phone calls Even in today's very competitive offices! Another great method is to
more efficiently, such as not picking market, there are ways to increase check competitor's Web sites.
profits:
up the phone when it rings while you
are working on an appraisal. 1. "Fire" high maintenance Doug Smith is the author of the
- Don't procrastinate. It results in tak- clients/AMCs, who continually analysis below. Reprinted from
ing more time for a task. require extra services without paying Doug's 2/11 article in Appraisal
higher fees. Then you can accept Today, How to negotiate higher fees
Clues to over-pricing more assignments from clients who from AMCs.
Some good indicators are: take less time and are more prof-
1. Decline in number of assignments. itable. Win-Win Negotiations for
2. Increase of bids not resulting in an 2. Take more appraisals from high- Appraisers
assignment. profit clients, and less from low-prof- The purpose of negotiating
it clients. High-profit clients don't appraisal fees and conditions is to
How to tell if fees are going up require extra comps, revisions, resolve situations where what the
Fees have been low, but they are addenda, and fast turn-around times. appraiser wants conflicts with what
cyclical and they go up and down. They always pay their bills promptly, the client or the client's agent wants.
Don't miss the change in fees. and don't call every other day check- The aim of win-win negotiations is
Whenever there is increased demand, ing on "appraisal status". Time spent to find a solution that is acceptable to
and appraisers are turning down on these extra services, without extra both parties. The framework for these
work, AMCs are pressured to raise compensation, results in lower prof- negotiations implies a continuous
fees. its. relationship built on professionalism
3. Specialize in certain property types and good will.
Clues to under-pricing or geographic areas, so more work Appraisers are very familiar with
1. You are swamped with low fee can be done in less time. the negotiations that come into play
orders. when a person buys a home. These
2. Many new AMC clients are call- Exchanges of fee information and are negotiations where neither party
ing. the law expects to deal with the other in the
3. Asubstantial increase in accepted Since you can't go down to the future. These negotiations are largely
bids after negotiating a higher fee. local supermarket, or check newspa- confrontational and unpleasant.
per ads, to find out what your com-
Similarly, using manipulation such
What about AMC fees? petitors are charging, you have to ask as over-promising on a shorter deliv-
Fees vary widely among AMCs for them. Some appraisers worry that if ery date can undermine trust and
the same property. They also vary they ask another appraiser what they damage business relationships. This
widely by geographic location. Try to charge, they could be violating the is particularly true since many
renegotiate the fee. It can work, law. appraisal management companies
although few appraisers try. When The issue is price fixing, whether scrupulously track turn-around time.
you started your business you finally or not a group of appraisers conspires
Allowing no flexibility and holding
found some good clients after mov- to fix fees on a specific job, or to fix
to a "take-or-leave-it" stance misses
ing others to your "nonapproved" all fees at a certain level (i.e. residen-
the point that negotiation is a busi-
client list. It works the same for tial lender fees). In the real world, it's
ness fact-of-life. The "hardball"
August 2012–©Appraisal Today–PAGE 3
approach is not much use when it Dr. Phil makes the case as follows:
scheduler is empowered to act on is
comes to resolving issues where "Step number one is making the deci-
reasonable.
there is an ongoing relationship. sion that you have the right to negoti-
In almost every case, there is
Manners count with honesty and ate and that you are worth standing
greater fee available at the onset of
openness the hallmark of legitimate up for yourself, getting the best price,
the appraisal fee negotiation process.
business interests. For a negotiation and not being taken advantage of.
to be "win-win" both parties should Claim that right, and know that
Fee Negotiation Strategy
feel positive about the negotiation you're not doing something wrong if
Appraisers contacted by phone with
when it's over. you do."
the usual question as to fee and turn-
Appraisers successful in their busi-
around process must be prepared for
The Fairness Triangle - Scope, Fee, ness are successful because they
this initial offer. Clients sort them-
and turn time expect to be successful. Appraisers
selves down to clients who are well
For appraisers, there are three
who expect success in their negotia-
known to the appraiser and whose fee
major elements in the negotiation
tions treat negotiation not as a con-
schedule they already know and those
process: scope of work, turnaround
frontation, but more of a professional
clients that are unknown to the
time and the appraisal fee.
collaboration.
appraiser and whose fees they must
If these were represented as the
Armed with the self-confidence
learn.
three sides of an equilateral triangle,
ample competency brings, deciding
For those clients where the apprais-
these three elements should represent
to negotiate is the serious first step
er does not know the spread, a quali-
balance or symmetry. In a profession-
towards achieving measurable results
fication question is in order. After
al relationship, the client gives the
from the negotiation process.
being asked for fee and turnaround
appraiser adequate time to complete
time, the appraiser qualifies the client
the scope of work and the fee com- The Spread on Fees - who approves
with a simple question: "What are
pensates the appraiser for fulfilling fee changes, and when?
your usual fees and turnaround time
the scope of work within the agreed The typical appraisal management
for this assignment?" The fee quoted
upon time schedule. company's business model relies on
will often be the floor fee amount.
Negotiation comes into play when clients paying a set fee for appraisals.
For the unknown client, it is then
the fee is not sufficient to compen- These companies locate and employ
necessary to determine the scope of
sate the appraiser for an expanded appraisers who take on producing
work. This is where appraisers find it
scope of work or the appraiser is not appraisals at a discounted rate with
handy to have two or three monitors.
given enough time to competently the appraisal company maximizing
If the scheduler will state the
carry the work necessary to complete its revenues depending on how suc-
address of the property, the appraiser
the scope of work. The fee itself is cessful they can be finding at
can quickly check public records on
not the only factor in fee negotia- appraisers willing to accept fees
one of their monitors and determine a
tions. within a certain range.
great deal about the necessary scope
What is clearly evident is that there
of work in terms of the complexity of
Don't forget about when you are are two step fee schedules that allow
the inspection and, with the neighbor-
paid the appraisal scheduler to accept fees
Fees include when they are paid. hood identified, perhaps the availabil-
within certain ranges. Anything
Recently more companies are mov- ity and proximity of comparables.
above this level requires the sched-
ing to paying their accounts in 45 It is appropriate to ask if there are
uler to go up one level of supervi-
days with the 45 days starting on the any additional requirements of the
sion.
first of the month following the date assignment. Recently one major
For example, the scheduler sets out
of the appraisal. When fees are paid AMC increased the number of
to place a typical 1004 with instruc-
is a legitimate subject for a negotiat- mandatory comparables to five along
tions to pay $325.00. However, to
ed settlement. with at least two listings. These types
place the assignment, the scheduler is
of requests add real time to the
able to accept a fee of $350.00.
What is yourattitude toward appraisal process and require fee con-
For anything above this, the sched-
negotiating? sideration in setting the fee for the
uler must seek authorization. The
An appraiser's attitude toward the assignment.
scheduler is anxious to place the
negotiation process is the main dri- The appraiser at this point may pro-
order and therefore the appraiser is
ving force in any interaction with a ceed to quote a fee. As a rule of
put in a good bargaining position if
client or a client's representative. thumb, the scheduler has at the most
the upper tier of the fee level the
PAGE 4–©Appraisal Today–August 2012
about $100.00 above the threshold ness to accept the assignment and in remuneration which is fair to all
amount with which to negotiate. If demonstrate that the appraiser has the concerned.
this is a reasonable fee, then the license level and competency to com- The objective of most appraisal
negotiations can be quickly conclud- plete the assignment. assignments is to provide support for
ed. An appraiser should maintain a a decision involving financing of the
However, even at the upper level friendly demeanor throughout, always subject property. The appraiser then
the scheduler is empowered to nego- holding out the prospect of an ongo- must rely on the framework set out in
tiate, the fee may not represent fair ing relationship despite any unreason- the scope of work and, if the process
remuneration for the assignment. The able fee offer or extraordinary scope has been competently followed, the
negotiation must then move on the of work requirement. appraiser has no choice, but to con-
next step, trades and alternatives. Never close the door. It is entirely clude the process.
likely that the appraisal management It may be a better alternative to sim-
Trades and alternatives company may be completely unfamil- ply not accept the assignment, empha-
Going back to the example of the iar with the local fee structure. Failing sizing the long term consequences.
fairness triangle, the appraiser can to reach a settlement, the negotiations Given the strident "take or leave it"
perhaps suggest a change in the move to the second level where the tone of some engagement letters;
scope of work or a change in due scheduler must consult with their appraisers must simply be prepared
date. supervisor. NOTto take the tone personally and
Given more time, the appraiser meet these demands in a business-like
may be able to fit an appraisal in as Expected outcomes and manner.
"filler" type business at the consequences if you can't schedule a Appraisers soon learn in their
announced fee. Achange in scope of fee increase from the scheduler appraisal career, the real estate profes-
work may not be possible, but a If the scheduler cannot settle on a sion is largely driven by the state of
drive-by appraisal may be appropri- fee, the scheduler can move the the economy.
ate to the assignment rather than a request to a higher authority or simply
Appraisers are now operating in a
full 1004. Adesk review may serve close the negotiations and move on to
climate of uncertainty that is testing
the purposes of the assignment rather the next appraiser on their list.
the ability of appraisers to not only
than a field review. To avoid outright rejection, the
understand local markets, but also to
The appraiser may learn some- appraiser can increase their chances communicate their findings to clients.
thing in the initial conversation that for further consideration by again All this takes time that affects an
is unknown to the scheduler that may indicating a willingness to take the appraiser's productivity and therefore
affect the fee schedule. The home assignment if only for a greater fee demands an appraiser's careful atten-
may be a manufactured home rather and pointing out some aspect of the tion. To accomplish these goals
than a frame built home requiring the assignment that requires a higher fee. appraisers must be fairly compensated
appraisal to be completed on a dif- If the offered fee is simply not and this demands increased attention
ferent form. The structure may be within the typical range of fees for the to the negotiation process.
different from the norm such as log market, that is certainly worthy of
The underlying fee structure of
home or waterfront property requir- mention. That is very clearly the case
most appraisal management compa-
ing additional research and report for rural properties in Montana. If in
nies allows for higher fees. Therefore,
development. fact, the scheduler does consult with a
applying the general strategy of
Most companies adopt a differing higher authority, they likely will come "Always ask for more." fits into a
fee schedule for Jumbo Loans. back with a counter offer. The "win-win" strategy fair to all con-
Therefore ,the value of the property appraiser must be prepared to meet cerned.
determined by the tax assessment this offer as perhaps the last and final
may be relevant at this stage of the offer and determine the extent of any
negotiation process. compromise.
At this stage in the negotiation the
When withdrawing is the only
front line scheduler has two basic
option
questions: "Can this appraiser do this
Finally, the negotiation process may
appraisal and, if offered, will the
reach a point where no amount of
appraiser accept the assignment?"
negotiation given the required scope
Throughout the process, it is criti-
of work and turnaround time results
cal that the appraiser show a willing-
August 2012–©Appraisal Today–PAGE 5
The best Web Sites and email lists for appraiser networking,
information,
and help with appraisal problems
Ikeep writing about connecting the bloggers writing. Most allow Internet, often within minutes.
with other appraisers face to face. readers to post comments. When you have a business ques-
But online is another very different, tions, such as a collection problem,
but easily available way you can Abrief history of appraisers online you can get advice quickly. When
find out what is happening. My first online communications you have general appraisal questions,
I remember the pre-Internet days were on Compuserve and AOLin you can get feedback.
for appraisers. For example, it would 1992, before the Internet was easily
often take months before appraisers available with the first Web browser, What to discuss
found out about new Fannie guide- Mosaic. Sending emails was very What would you want to discuss?
lines. expensive. I think it was around $ .20 Here are just a few of the topics dis-
Many appraisers are in one- per email. I remember bills from cussed on appraiser mailing lists and
appraiser firms or have only a few Compuserve of hundreds of dollars a chat boards.
appraisers in their offices. month. * AMCs - a very popular topic
Communicating with other appraisers There were several live chat meet- * Customary and reasonable fees - a
can be very valuable. Discussed ings for appraisers. I ran one on popular topic
below are active appraiser chat Compuserve. * How to appraise an unusual proper-
boards, email-only discussion Microsoft, Compuserve, and AOL ty and many other appraisal ques-
groups, blogs, and one-way email were afraid of the Internet, and were tions.
newsletters, such as the one I send reluctant to provide Internet access to * Whether a prospective client pays
out. their users. The Internet competed promptly.
with them. * USPAPissues.
Archived vs. non-archived Of course, as we all know, they * How to get more business.
I prefer Web-based chat groups so finally "saw the light" and realized
I can choose whether to get postings what was happening. They became Activity on chat boards, blogs, and
via email or check the Web site peri- ISPs for Internet users. email lists
odically. Activity varies widely. Some have
Most groups now are Web based - Rants and going off topic few postings and some have many,
Yahoo Groups, Google Groups, All groups, not just appraiser many postings. See if you can be
Linkedin, etc. Setting up a new dis- groups, have rants and negative com- notified if there are new posts for the
cussion topic is very easy. ments. Some have more than others. I ones you like.
Managing email lists is a night- don't know why, but the Internet
mare. I started my one-way email list tends to attract people who are nega- Using Yahoo, Google, etc. Groups
in 1992 and finally went with an tive. Unfortunately, they drive away Most of the appraiser email chats
online service in the mid-2000s. other participants. are done through Yahoo Groups
This is the main reason many because they were the first to make it
One way vs. chat appraisers don't like online interac- available.
My Appraisal Today free email tion. Below I discuss which appraiser Recently Google has started
newsletter is one-way. I send emails sites have lots rants and going off groups. Linkedin also has appraiser
and there is way to discuss any top- topic. groups.
ics. I am planning on setting up a Go to http://groups.yahoo.com/ or
blog so readers can respond. But Why join a chat group? go to www.yahoo.com and look for
only parts of my emails would be Remember what it was like pre- the Groups link on the left side of the
posted, probably those with my orig- Internet for appraisal-related news, page. Search for appraiser, appraisal,
inal comments. such as new FHArequirements? or real estate appraiser. There are
Blogs Often, appraisers were the last to find many groups.
out. Now, the information is on the
Blogs work well for responding to Visit the groups you're interested in
PAGE 6–©Appraisal Today–August 2012
to see what topics are discussed and can get the postings by email. I AppraisalInstitute and
how many messages are sent each check facebook every day as many ValuationReview. I signed up for
day. You can choose to have all the of my local experimental/avant garde weekly email updates. Some of the
emails sent to you, you can read musicians post on facebook. groups may be closed.
them on the web site, or both. Both groups are active with little Taking a look at other groups, I
Archived messages and the ability or no ranting allowed. found Real Estate Appraiser
to group by topics is a significant Connection, fairly active, set up by
advantage, as compared with email- Google groups Dwellworks.com; Appraisal Group.
only lists where finding a specific Google groups are relatively new. There are many "suggested" appraisal
email can be tough. Somehow google erased all my groups listed once you join one
Setting up a group for a specialized groups and destroyed my youtube group. This looks like the best way to
topic is very easy using Yahoo music channel as well. I think this find other groups.
Groups. was related to their purchase of I don't recommend starting a
Tips on using Yahoo Groups. youtube. linkedin group as it is much more dif-
• Finding a group can be difficult. I found a few emails from one of ficult to use than yahoo groups.
Try searching under different names. my erased groups and rejoined. The Maybe they were made available so
I searched for "real estate appraisers" interface was a little less easy to use people looking for jobs and so job
and found many groups. See which than yahoo. Of course, google is for recruiters could get more info.
ones are active (how many recent young people who have lots of time Appraisers have posted compliants
postings) and how many members to fiddle with their changes. about all the job postings. Since the
there are. Some require moderator Hopefully the groups feature will purpose of linkedin is jobs, I doubt
approval. improve for those of us with limited this will be changed. Some commer-
• Sort the list by topic so you can time and no patience. cial appraisers have told me that they
find related emails easier. Almost all of the groups I found got a few assignments through
when searching for real estate linkedin.
What about lurkers? appraiser were about real estate sales.
I seldom post anything. I have no None of the groups I could find were How to find and evaluate groups
idea why. I used to post, but could active. Maybe you will have better In this article, I only discuss the
never think of anything to add that luck. larger, well known, national groups.
was new to the discussion. We are Search the groups using the word
called lurkers and are the vast major- Linked in appraiser and see what you find. Or,
ity of "participants". There are several active appraiser search for local groups such as:
groups on linkedin. You have to be a Appraisers South Carolina.
Facebook linkedin member. See who is in the group and the
The group Appraisers is closed and Since linkedin is set for employed number of recent postings.
is only open to licensed appraisers. people to network for jobs, there are Unfortunately, many groups don't take
No rants. Good discussions on job postings there, which can get off and have very few postings.
appraisal issues. I was invited soon annoying.
after it started. See who is an active The most active group is USPAP Start yourown group
poster and send them a message ask- Group. When it first started, postings
Just do it!! Local groups are partic-
ing to be added. If you don't know were by USPAPexperts. Over time,
ularly useful.
the person, send your license number. it has more non-USPAPpostings,
Getting people to post to a new
Another active group is I am a real with more residential non-USPAP
group can be tough. Plan on doing a
estate appraiser - national appraiser issues. Lots of interesting threads,
lot of postings yourself to get it start-
coalition. This group is open. I am but not as easy to use as yahoo
ed and invite other appraisers to join.
not sure how to join the group. groups. I subscribe to the emails sent
Of course, you must be on face- out once a week that list the active Managing emails (if you choose to
book to access the groups. discussions. get email notification)
If you're a regular facebook user, The Real Estate Expert Witness Fortunately, all the web-based
your groups' activity will be posted Group is also good. Technical expert groups allow you to choose whether
on the left of your facebook page. witness discussions mostly. Also dis- or not to receive emails of the post-
If you seldom check facebook, and cussions on marketing. ings. I only get emails from a few
you're interested in the group, you Other groups I am in are groups now.
August 2012–©Appraisal Today–PAGE 7
Some groups have a few a few Internet posting by Brian Davis, try another group.
emails a week and others send out SRA, "This list is NOTsponsored by
20-50 (or more) per day. I prefer lists alamode, Inc., and in no way repre- Getting help on business issues,
where I don't receive all the emails, sents alamode's views, opinions, or such as collection
The groups are typically better on
such as Yahoo groups, and online technical support of its WinTotal or
these types of problems, as they are
chat boards such as Pocket Total products. It is an online
more "generic" than appraisal issues.
Appraisersforum.com. community of real estate appraisers
Every day since the mid-1990s I sharing information, tips, tricks, and For example, collecting from dead-
have received emails from appraiser solutions that we can all use in our beats, fees, etc.
chat groups. Some of the groups send daily appraisal businesses." Public
Finding groups
out lots of messages, some allow list - you can read the postings with-
This can be a bit tricky, especially
chit-chat and some don't. out signing up for the list. Discusses
on a very large site such as Yahoo
I prefer to check the postings lots of appraiser topics. Some chit-
Groups.
online, but if I can't, or I want to get chat, but mostly stays on topic. Has
Try searching for real estate
daily info, I filter each of the groups had fewer postings in the past few
appraiser. To look within your state,
into an email folder so I don't have to years.
try appraiser Texas. Or other search
spend lots of time transferring the Mobile Appraiser Group, search
terms.
emails. for MobileAppraiserGroup.
Another very good method is to set The"Unofficial pocket pc/laptop /
How active are the groups?
up a free email account on yahoo or pen tablet/Disto/GPS/Sidekick /just
You can find out by looking at a
hotmail for all the messages to get about anything mobile user's list"
group before you join. For example:
them out of your regular email inbox. specifically dealing with mobile
463 members with no postings in 2
technology related field hardware
weeks. Another example: 1203 mem-
AppraiserYahoo Groups and software. This list is not spon-
bers, 3 postings today. Or, 3 mem-
With Yahoo Groups, you can have sored by any software nor hardware
bers with no postings for 2 years.
all the emails sent to you, get a daily companies, and in no way represents
The more active the group, the
digest, or read online. I read most of the views, opinions, or technical sup-
more information will be posted. On
my Yahoo groups online. port of any companies products."
the minus side, they are usually
My favorite group is the Discusses technical topics. Not much
national in scope. Groups for local or
InlandAppraisers Group, search for chit-chat. Not as active as other
within a state may be smaller.
InlandCAAppraisersForum. "This groups.
group provides help ... on issues of
Software email chat groups
mutual interest from client pressures, Getting help on appraisal problems
See if your forms software compa-
to education and credentials. The groups vary widely on the
ny has a chat email or web posting
Journeymen, vocational, professional, expertise of the members who post.
site. Here are three below that have
retired and trainee appraisers are wel- Appraisersforum.com tends to have
been around for awhile. On Yahoo
come for their knowledge, insights or the widest range of expertise. The
Groups - SFREP-UserGroup,
questions. Real estate values are loca- Yahoo groups are smaller, so it is
Total2000 (a la mode), ACI-user-
tion specific, economic forces may easier to see who is knowledgable.
group. Just search for the name of
effect each sub-market in different For national issues, such as Fannie
your software.
ways. If you have identified a local Mae guidelines and USPAPissues,
Your software vendor may have a
factor that can be quantified in an the groups usually work out well,
chat group that they host. They can
objective way, please share it." with relatively few rants.
be good for answering questions.
Moderated by Steve Smith, who I think that it is very sad when an
To find out about problems that
posts a lot of useful information. appraiser posts a question about a
you are having, groups not hosted by
Focuses on Southern California , but local issue on a national forum. It is
the software vendor can't be con-
discusses a wide range of topics of always best to contact another local
trolled by the vendor. If you have a
interest to residential appraisers. appraiser. If you do this, be careful to
problem with the software and want
Some chit-chat, but mostly stays on evaluate the responses from out of
frank comments from other users,
topic. the area appraisers.
this may work for you. I recommend
Total 2000 Users Group(started What if you post a question and no
using both vendor-hosted and user-
8/99), search for one responds? Try posting later,
only groups for the forms software
Total2000UsersGroup. Per an when the group is more active. Or,
PAGE 8–©Appraisal Today–August 2012
that you use. hot topics very quickly here and get the person writing the email.
a wide range of opinions. Sometimes has some excellent arti-
Blogs You can get emails of postings on cles. Archives online - easily accessi-
Many blogs allow readers to post topics that you are interested in. Way ble.
comments. Newspapers also allow too many postings to get all of them, • FHA(notices of changes, meetings,
comments. They allow feedback and for me anyway. and lots of other info):
a "community" feeling. There is sometimes incorrect infor- www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/ref/hsgr
There are way too many to keep mation posted. Usually a correction egst.cfm This is email-only but are
track of. Here are a few of the more is posted, but not always. Be sure to only sent out about once a week.
active blogs that I like: check out what the other posters say • Appraisal News Online summaries
• Appraisalscoop.com - all types of or check it out somewhere else. of news stories:
appraisal issues from many contribu- Many of the posters are negative, http://www.appraisalinstitute.org/abo
tors. Email notification of new top- common for many chat boards. Just ut/newsletter/ Archives are at
ics. Allows comments. Very good skip the those posts. www.appraisalinstitute.org
blog, run by Brian Davis for many • Mortgage fraud news: www.mort-
years. Lots of interesting comments. Appraisal associations gagefraudblog.com. You can get peri-
I often refer readers to this list for Many appraisal associations have odic email notification of links to
hot topics so they can post comments private (members only) chat boards, recent postings.
and read other appraisers' comments. such as the Appraisal Institute, ASA,
• appraiserlawblog.com - run by NAIFAand the Appraisal Section of Commercial appraiseronline tips:
Peter Christensen of Liability NAR. If you're a member of an • Most participants in the email lists
Insurance Administrators. I don't see appraisal association, check out your and chat boards above are residential
anywhere to sign up for notification association's Web site. I haven't seen appraisers, as the vast majority of
of postings. Very well written. I send many postings on these sites, but appraisers are residential.
out a notice in my email newsletter they are worth checking out if you're • There are sometimes good discus-
when I find out that there is a new a member. sion on the linkedin chat groups.
posting. No email notification. No They used to be active, but I don't • For info on computer topics, all the
comments. see many postings now. lists are fairly good. Just post a mes-
• mortgagefraudblog.com - the Best sage and someone will be able to
for finding out legal stuff for law- "One way" email only help you.
suits, etc. Mostly non-appraiser. You I recommend all the lists below. Linkedin's group, The Real Estate
can get regular emails with lists of All the lists except FHAhave the Expert Witness Group, is a "must
headlines of postings. I mostly check ability to access old emails. join" if you do expert witness work.
it online and search for appraiser. • My email is "one way": I send it Technical expert witness discussions
• appraiseractive.blogspot.com - by out and you receive it. There are no mostly. Also discussions on market-
Frank Gregiore, who is active in discussions. To sign up, go to ing. The AppraisalInstitute group has
Florida and national issues. No email www.appraisaltoday.com. I have some commercial topics.
notification of new postings. links to the old emails posted on my
home page. Which group(s) should you join?
Appraisersforum.com - most active • Appraisal Buzz Forum: If you like to keep up on the latest
online chat board www.appraisalbuzz.com Easiest to tech info, Mobile Appraisers can
get by getting the emails, but there work, but postings have declined. For
The most active chat board is
are lots each day. Archives online general appraisal and computer-relat-
www.appraisersforum.com (free, but
where you can go periodically if you ed discussions, Wintotal is good.
registration is required). It is a moni-
don't want to get the many emails Inland Appraisers is good for
tored list (after messages are posted),
that go out each day. Not much ranti- Southern California and also good for
so messages that don't contribute to
ng. Archives can be tricky to use as general appraisal discussions.
the topic are regulated.
they use an older email software, All the groups are good for residen-
Of all the email lists and Web chat
Mailman. tial appraisers. The AI forum is good
boards, this one has the widest range
• Appraisal Buzz Newsletter - a few for commercial appraisers, but has
of participants. Sometimes the infor-
times a week sends out articles writ- many emails every day.
mation posted is based on a rumor or
is not correct. But you find out about ten by various people. Tends to be Fortunately, almost all the discus-
promotional, as some are paid PR for sion groups are Web based now. You
August 2012–©Appraisal Today–PAGE 9
can choose to get emails of the post- many email and chat boards unless
ings, or just check them online. they are very heavily monitored and
all postings must be approved by the
Local chat boards and email moderator. If you choose to not
discussion groups receive emails, this is much less of a
Many local groups are active.
problem as you only look at the
Check in your area.
threads that look interesting.
The REAA(Real Estate Appraisal
Association) in California has an Who can see what I post?
active Yahoo Group. The Yahoo name Some groups are private and only
is REAAForum. members can see them. Others, such
as appraisersforum.com are indexed
Start yourown group by search engines so your postings
Setting up an email chat group is are more likely to be seen.
very easy in Yahoo Groups. Very little
Some are ‘semi-private”: only
work is required unless you want to
members can post, but anynoe can
pre-approve participants or pre-
read.
approve messages.
The Primary Rule of online com-
To get the list started, post it on one
munication: Assume that anyone
(or more) of the other active Yahoo
can see what you email orpost. Be
appraiser groups. See what other
careful out there!! Even if it is pri-
appraiser-related groups specialize in,
vate, one of the members may
and which are the most active.
decide to post yourcomments on a
What are some group ideas: public chat board.
• Geographic (Texas, northern
Arkansas, Detroit, etc.) Disclaimer
• Type of appraisals (hotels, reloca- I'm sure I have missed lots of web
tion, FHA, REOs, etc.) sites. Send me an email and let me
know what I've missed!!
How to manage emails
There are two commonly used
methods
1. Set up a separate free email
account for subscribing to the groups.
2. Use your own account and filter
the messages into folders. This is how
I handle all the emails. It is very easy
to set up.
Both methods are used by many
appraisers.
Should you communicate with
appraisers online?
I monitor all the email and Web
posting sites for this newsletter. Some
I like more than others. See what you
like.
Positive: Keep up with the latest
news, post your own opinion, be part
of a group, ask questions, etc.
Negative: too many chatty, off topic
posts, too much negativity, too much
time. These negatives are common in
PAGE 10–©Appraisal Today–August 2012